Eli5: What is modernism and post-modernism?
In: 81
What comes after postmodernism? If that our current era?
What comes after postmodernism? If that our current era?
The song I.G.Y from Donald Fagen’s 1982 solo album The Nightfly captures the pure sentiment of Modernism perfectly, though I think there MAY be an ironic undertone, Given Fagen’s usual slightly snarky tone.
“Get your ticket to that wheel in space while there’s time,
The fix is in
You’ll be a witness to that game of chance in the sky
You know we’ve got to win
Here at home we’ll play in the city
Powered by the sun
Perfect weather for a streamlined world
There’ll be spandex jackets, one for everyone”
Great album by the way. Worth a listen all the way through.
Edit: added lyrics
The song I.G.Y from Donald Fagen’s 1982 solo album The Nightfly captures the pure sentiment of Modernism perfectly, though I think there MAY be an ironic undertone, Given Fagen’s usual slightly snarky tone.
“Get your ticket to that wheel in space while there’s time,
The fix is in
You’ll be a witness to that game of chance in the sky
You know we’ve got to win
Here at home we’ll play in the city
Powered by the sun
Perfect weather for a streamlined world
There’ll be spandex jackets, one for everyone”
Great album by the way. Worth a listen all the way through.
Edit: added lyrics
Modernism: make everything better in every way we can.
Post modernism: everything must be destroyed.
Modernism: make everything better in every way we can.
Post modernism: everything must be destroyed.
tl;dr: Modernism is about “grand narratives”, the arc of human history headed somewhere. Post-modernism is “deconstructionist” and questions the meaning and purpose of these grand stories preferring to view a variety of perspectives as possibly being valid in their own frame of reference.
Modern philosophies are those that have a “grand narrative” at their core. They say that humanity started at one definite place and is headed toward a different (generally better) definite place, and that journey is somewhat inevitable. This includes a wide range of perspectives including religions, political movements and even both capitalism and communism. Communism (as Marx saw it) is actually a perfect example. Society is now largely driven by the relationship between laborers and the owners of capital/means of production and the owners have most of the power in society, but eventually, the laborers will seize that capital/means of production and usher in a new social order where they have all of the power. Start one place, end somewhere else, the journey is inevitable.
Post-modernism, though, is “deconstructionist”, meaning it tends to question the very definitions of key ideas. Post-modernism is skeptical of grand narratives altogether, seeing human society as being much more like a ship floating aimlessly at sea. If a modernist says “I’m going to take my car to get from point A to point B”, the post-modernist would ask why you would prefer to be at B, who in society doesn’t have access to make that trip, and what even is a car anyway? In the case of Communism, the post-modernist would ask “who is still being left out? what about those that aren’t laborers like the elderly, children, and those with disabilities? or those whose work hasn’t generally been considered labor like housewives?
***The Big Key*** here is that post-modernism is a direct response to modernism, as another post pointed out, particularly in the aftermath of WWII, the Holocaust, and the rise of the threat of nuclear Armageddon in the Cold War. Modernists saw humanity “moving upwards”, then a bunch of bad things happened that were only made possible by the very same things they thought had improved humanity, and that’s the moment that Post-modernism came in to ask “what does ‘upwards’ even mean?”
tl;dr: Modernism is about “grand narratives”, the arc of human history headed somewhere. Post-modernism is “deconstructionist” and questions the meaning and purpose of these grand stories preferring to view a variety of perspectives as possibly being valid in their own frame of reference.
Modern philosophies are those that have a “grand narrative” at their core. They say that humanity started at one definite place and is headed toward a different (generally better) definite place, and that journey is somewhat inevitable. This includes a wide range of perspectives including religions, political movements and even both capitalism and communism. Communism (as Marx saw it) is actually a perfect example. Society is now largely driven by the relationship between laborers and the owners of capital/means of production and the owners have most of the power in society, but eventually, the laborers will seize that capital/means of production and usher in a new social order where they have all of the power. Start one place, end somewhere else, the journey is inevitable.
Post-modernism, though, is “deconstructionist”, meaning it tends to question the very definitions of key ideas. Post-modernism is skeptical of grand narratives altogether, seeing human society as being much more like a ship floating aimlessly at sea. If a modernist says “I’m going to take my car to get from point A to point B”, the post-modernist would ask why you would prefer to be at B, who in society doesn’t have access to make that trip, and what even is a car anyway? In the case of Communism, the post-modernist would ask “who is still being left out? what about those that aren’t laborers like the elderly, children, and those with disabilities? or those whose work hasn’t generally been considered labor like housewives?
***The Big Key*** here is that post-modernism is a direct response to modernism, as another post pointed out, particularly in the aftermath of WWII, the Holocaust, and the rise of the threat of nuclear Armageddon in the Cold War. Modernists saw humanity “moving upwards”, then a bunch of bad things happened that were only made possible by the very same things they thought had improved humanity, and that’s the moment that Post-modernism came in to ask “what does ‘upwards’ even mean?”
In the briefest possible terms:
Modernism is what happened when the humanist values of the Enlightenment collided with the capitalist dystopia of the Industrial Revolution. After humanism seemingly won (by imposing moral restrictions on employment of children, length of the workday, humane working conditions, and so on), people became convinced that industry (science and technology) could be a positive force if guided by humanist ideals.
Post-modernism is the cynicism about the value of human life that emerged from the trenches of WWI and then crystallized after WWII in Western Europe. It rejects all notion of reason and objectivity. Post-modernism contributes nothing to the progress of mankind because it rejects the idea of progress and as an intellectual endeavor has struggled to justify itself except as opposition to the pre-existing philosophies.
In the briefest possible terms:
Modernism is what happened when the humanist values of the Enlightenment collided with the capitalist dystopia of the Industrial Revolution. After humanism seemingly won (by imposing moral restrictions on employment of children, length of the workday, humane working conditions, and so on), people became convinced that industry (science and technology) could be a positive force if guided by humanist ideals.
Post-modernism is the cynicism about the value of human life that emerged from the trenches of WWI and then crystallized after WWII in Western Europe. It rejects all notion of reason and objectivity. Post-modernism contributes nothing to the progress of mankind because it rejects the idea of progress and as an intellectual endeavor has struggled to justify itself except as opposition to the pre-existing philosophies.
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