I keep hearing about people in jail for 3+ years awaiting trial. If they’re ‘innocent until proven guilty’ I dont understand why they are confined. I thought there was a right to a speedy trial also or is that not really the case?
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3+ years before trial means they committed murder or something that will result in decades of prison.
They are a risk to the public. Even if you are presumed innocent society does not need to take the risk that you are not innocent. So they are not released.
The Defendant wants to win his case so he takes as much time he needs to gather his evidence before doing a trial.
“Speedy trial” is a right, but a lot of defendants who know the evidence is against them, choose to wait it out, hoping that the charges will be dropped, the witnesses will forget details, some witnesses will move away (or die), etc. – all of which increase their chance of winning in trial or otherwise being truly free when released.
The longer they sit in jail awaiting the trial they may win, the more likely they are to enter a guilty plea in hopes of getting probation (often with onerous conditions most are bound to violate).
Cuz everyone involved in that space that’s making money off of it rationalizes the delays or believes they’re inherent to the process
Saying that you’re in the US, land if the “free”, without saying you’re in the US. That would actually be illegal, except for some very rare cases in my country.
The true answer for the US, is that you are willing to hold innocent people in jail for a prolonged time, you have a for profit prison system and you have this monetary bail system.
>If they’re ‘innocent until proven guilty’ I don’t understand why they are confined. I thought there was a right to a speedy trial also or is that not really the case?
Though there is “Innocent until proven guilty,” there is also Public Safety that needs to be considered. I don’t know how it is done everywhere, but in my county/state, every single person arrested must go before a judge within 24 hours. Our county has a Pretrial Program that will review each defendant, that defendant’s case, and that defendant’s criminal history. They also interview that defendant while they are in jail awaiting first appearance (FA). With all of this info, the pretrial officer will make suggestions to the judge, and the judge has final say as to whether or not a defendant can be released on their own recognizance, released to a pretrial program, released with an ankle monitor, or released with bond/bail (or a combination of any/all of these options), OR if they must stay in jail.
For instance, **Bob** beat his wife last night. He’s never done anything like this before. He has a clean criminal history. He’s lived in his town for 30 years and held the same job for 20 years. He would most likely be released to a pretrial program, possibly with an ankle monitor, and a No Contact Order to keep him away from his wife, and ordered to return to court at such and such a date.
**Jim** shot his wife last night. He’s been arrested for five Attempted Murders, ten DUIs, five Assaults, three Domestic Batterys, and one Resisting an Officer without Violence. He’s only lived in his town for 2 years, doesn’t have a job, and doesn’t have an alternate residence to stay at. Because of his criminal history, the good chance that he may reoffend, the threat to public safety, and that he most likely won’t return to court, he either isn’t released at all, or is given a large (but not excessive) bond. If Jim can’t afford bail, he will have to stay in, or try to get his bail reduced/modified. Until then, he stays in jail.
In our county, about 90% of the time, the **JIMs** of the world are still in jail because of things BESIDES not being able to afford bail – they *can’t* be released, they’re being held on felonies, they’re waiting for transfer to State Hospital or Prison… it is rare that it is ONLY BECAUSE OF BAIL that a person can’t get out.
The right to a speedy trial is a thing, but your idea of speedy and the Judicial System’s idea of speedy are two different speeds. Legalities take time. Ts must be crossed, Is must be dotted. Paperwork must be filed correctly. Everything must be done exactly right, or a lawyer could argue that some random uncrossed “t” was enough to cause a mistrial.
Think of it this way… how many of us would be happy with the Judicial System of the Ted Bundys or Jeffrey Dahmers of the world were released willy-nilly?
People held in jail before trial are there for one of two reasons: they either can’t afford the bond that was set, or they were not given a bond at all. If they have been denied a bond that usually means that they’re charged with something very serious: murder, rape, arson, etc. More common is a bond that the defendant can’t afford. Judges are supposed to consider ability to pay in setting bond, but in practice it’s usually just based on the seriousness of the charge (the logic being that a person has a higher motivation to flee if he’s charged with something very serious) and any failures to appear for court in the past.
Regarding speedy trial, there’s a pretty big loophole there, which is basically that if a judge believes that the prosecution has “good cause” for a delay, he can give it to them without running afoul of the speedy trial rule. So if the crime lab is running behind, that time essentially doesn’t count for speedy trial purposes. There’s also waiver by the defendant. Sometimes, a defendant will agree to exclude a certain portion of time from the speedy trial calculation; in those cases, it’s usually because the defendant’s lawyer has something he needs to do but can’t get it done before trial. In those cases, the time you need to count up for a speedy trial violation will not include the time waived by the defendant
If the court requires a bond for release from jail but you can’t afford to post the bond, you stay in jail.
There are a shitload of uneducated responses here. I don’t know where you guys live but in my state, the amount of bail a defendant is held on is based on a two-part decision by the court. First, the court determines whether or not the defendant is a danger to themselves or to another person or the community. Second, the court determines if the defendant is a flight risk. If the defendant is a danger or poses a significant flight risk, then and only then can he be held on an amount of cash bail that he financially cannot afford. The law in my state – which is New Hampshire – specifically says that a defendant cannot be held pretrial solely because he cannot afford to pay his bail unless the court has determined that he is a danger or a flight risk. Nobody in New Hampshire at least is being held just because they can’t pay the “ransom.”
I’m not an expert in the field, but as far as I’m aware if people are held on bail it’s generally because the judge thinks they have the potential to be dangerous to themselves or others (or they’re a flight risk). There are many reason that they could be held so long, but they all come back to a ‘fair trial’ bring a cornerstone of the justice system. This means that fair representation is required, which is often justified by providing a court appointed defender. If there is anything that can slow down due process, for example no available public defender, then you can be held until that issue is resolved. In many countries, let alone just states in America there is a terrifying shortage of public defenders. There’s also another aspect that can impact jail time. Typically the decision of guilt or innocence is done at a different time to the decision of sentencing (time to serve). It’s very possible that someone be found guilty and then held in custody until sentencing. Which once again requires a fair trial.
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