There’s like this weird culture around it where some may even consider it rude or too personal like it’s equivalent to asking someone their social security number or something
I’ve heard a rumor it’s because companies/bosses don’t want people to talk about their pay between employees because they may find discrepancies compared to their coworkers, but I’m not 100% sure that’s actually why since even their employees consider it taboo.
In: Economics
I can separate the coworker relationship and friendship. I like the people I work with on a personal level. Many of us are friends, hangout, etc. However they are terrible coworkers. If I’m giving 80% effort each day, they are giving 35% at best. Every opportunity to be lazy is taken, the tough calls are always left for me or one of the few other guys who cares. I make like 7$ an hour more than my friend – he recently expressed wanting more money and hopes to be promoted. If they knew what I make, they would feel it is unfair, but they don’t do the same work I do. So I avoid that conversation. That said, people should talk about their pay to make sure they are treated fairly. It’s a double edged sword.
My empkoyer said to not discuss it. Sometimes people are paid more for certain qualifications but others don’t understand that. I’ve always liked working union because it’s public and generally the same but it can cause drama if other workers find out you make more and don’t think about objectively. I will very rarely discuss what I make with anyone
I’m usually open about my pay but I have one colleague I’m not open with. I know hers, but she doesn’t know mine. This is because she shows up for work whenever she likes and is basically on the brink of getting fired and/or ragequitting, and while she’s almost dead weight she takes enough of the edge off my workload (It’s ours but I do most of the work)I don’t want her ragequitting just yet.
She’s shit at her job but they won’t replace her once she’s gone. I both can’t wait for and dread the day she goes.
I used to be all for discussing salary openly until I went up in the pay scale and was making 50-100% more than a lot of my coworkers who had been at the company way longer. I was younger than most of them but came from a big tech company to a company of a few hundred people.
When I shared my salary with someone, he shared with others and I began to be treated differently. The guy I shared it with actually quit shortly after (good for him, he got the salary he deserved when he changed jobs). I got stuck with most of his work, I guess it was time to earn that salary.
I definitely still support salary discussions but I’d recommend people to tread carefully if you expect the differences are significantly higher or lower. Something like a 10% difference is good because that lets people know they can push management to get to that level. No one believes they can get a 50% raise as an internal promotion, that typically only happens with company changes. People will think that you don’t deserve that salary and they will treat you differently. They will leave the company at it will affect the morale and workload that you and your remaining team have to deal with 8 hours a day.
I’ve started handling these conversations like this: “I’m a little uncomfortable sharing that information, but if you throw out a number I will tell you if it’s higher or lower.” If they’re trying to use that information for their own salary discussion, they can still get a valid data point while minimizing potential blowback to me.
Because once workers get frustrated & see they’re not being compensated correctly, they might vote to start a union. Companies hate unions.
Because of the social and personal disruption it can cause due to the cognitive dissonance and disparity between the *appearance* of a salary being a simple objective number vs. the *reality* that it’s a very subjective and individual thing.
If one employee makes $100,000/yr and another makes $120,000/yr, there’s a very obvious objective difference there.
What isn’t obvious is which one does more, better, or higher level work. Which has special knowledge or skills that are currently valued higher. Which gets along better with coworkers, clients/customers, and managers. Which is more diligent, punctual, reliable. Which is more creative and open vs which is more stubborn and argumentative. Which has domain experience, company experience, knowledge, or connections from previous training or a previous job. Which is currently content vs. ambitious, complacent vs. always learning and growing. Which is simply easier to work with. Which have different benefits. And of course, which is more assertive and the better negotiator.
That’s in addition to things like where people fit in terms of budgeting and planning, of course.
The simple act of comparing two numbers really raises a ton of questions and a *lot* of subjective judgments. It all becomes baked into a number, and you can’t unbake the cake to see the ingredients and answer those questions.
Ideally, you’d know where you stand, your performance reviews are never a surprise, you have negotiated a salary that you’re comfortable with, and you know what needs to happen for you to get the next raise you want. So it shouldn’t matter what other people are making, and everybody talking about it should just be a trivial small talk thing.
But this is not an ideal simple world, it’s not objective but instead very subjective, very personal, and people get quite emotional about it. So that makes it rude and personal. Not because of the number, but because of all the other stuff.
Yeah I’m in a weird position. I work at Amazon IT and found out warehouse workers make more than me if they’re capped out. Explain that one. Rest of my team makes $10~ more than I do. Been here 3 years ~. $21 an hour in IT. I just get laughed at when I bring it up. “I thought the minimum was $24?”
CA has laws that prevent retaliation from discussing wages in the workplace precisely because of discrimination.
And it’s not limited to men v women. I and a friend moved from one company to another at the same time in 2001 we had the same jobs and performed about the same although I had much more experience and knowledge. He was paid a lot more than I was. Do you know what the owner said when I confronted him on this?
He’s married, you’re not.
To simply put it, this number invokes a reaction that the person sharing is usually better not having told anyone the number and the information can also be spread by others. We treat people differently based on how much they make. Lot of people might feel entitled to your money too or commit acts of jealousy.
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